Podcast Episode #131: Cholesterol Confusion, Gum & Do I Really Need to Eat Meat?

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1.  Updates [3:28] 2.  Eat Better Faster [10:52] 3.  Egg-cerpt from Eat the Yolks [24:11] 4.  High Cholesterol; so, what can I eat?  [26:51] 5.  Happy liver dude.  Paleo on, Wayne!  Paleo on, Garth!  [40:44] 6.  Do I really have to give up my gum?  [46:23] 7.  Do I need to eat meat?  [51:43]


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Liz Wolfe: Hey everyone! Welcome to episode 131 of the Balanced Bites podcast. That’s Diane, and I’m Liz. No real changes there. How you doing, D?

Diane Sanfilippo: Doing pretty good.

Liz Wolfe: That’s great news.

Diane Sanfilippo: Great.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Great. A quick word about our sponsors. Paleo Treats, we love all their goodies. They’re ethic, they’re awesomeness. We’ve got a very cool podcast with those two, Lee and Nick, they are awesome, and we love partnering up with them. They’re offer for our listeners is 15% off, just enter the code BALANCEDBITES at checkout over at Pete’s Paleo, bringing fine dining to your cave. Make eating paleo a little easier on yourself. Check out Pete’s meal plans; the meals are awesome for those nights when you’re just on the run or out of time, and you want real food fast. Pete’s Paleo is generously offering our listeners a free pound of bacon. Their bacon is just not to be missed, people.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: I just giggle, because I’m like, “The first one’s free.” {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: So good. Good bacon saves lives. It’s like hip openers. They save lives. The free pound of bacon with the purchase of any meal plan. The code is BBLOVESBACON at Just a note that 1 cent will come off your order total with that code, but they will throw in the bacon. Finally, Chameleon Cold-Brew. Available at many grocery stores nationwide. Check out their website for a store locator. Or, you can do what we do and order it online, because they ship. Chameleon Cold-Brew is organic, fair trade, smooth, rich. Are you drinking it right now, Diane?

{ice clinking}

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Do you hear it?

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok, wait. {swirling ice in glass}

Liz Wolfe: There it is!

Diane Sanfilippo: You can hear mine? OK.

Liz Wolfe: For our listeners, enter the code BALANCEDBITES at checkout at to save a whole bunch off your order. I don’t know how much it was, but it was good.

Diane Sanfilippo: We don’t know how much.

Liz Wolfe: And it covered shipping. And, you don’t have to go to the store. Which is great, because I hate going to the store, because I always feel like I have to shower, and…

Diane Sanfilippo: And underwear might fall out of your pant leg.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. {laughs} Panties fall out of my pant leg.

Diane Sanfilippo: That’s a throw-back to a really old podcast episode.

Liz Wolfe: Oh my gosh.

Diane Sanfilippo: I think. Hopefully.

Liz Wolfe: No, that’s a really old one, for sure.

1. Updates [3:28]

Diane Sanfilippo: Updates; what’s going on in the middle of the farm?

Liz Wolfe: Green things are sprouting.

Diane Sanfilippo: Really?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, it was dead just burnt out, beige. Everything is beige. And all of a sudden, we have one warm day, and the grass is starting to poke up past everything, and we’re putting together the garden. We’ve sprouted a bunch of seeds. And I’m just waiting to see that first tick.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, jeeze.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m not excited to hear about it again.

Liz Wolfe: I’ve got to write about this, because we do have this. I mean, I’ve got my three-pronged approach at the ready.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: I’ve got my natural solutions, times 3, and they weren’t all fully ready last year. So I’m kind of ready to try them out.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m just picturing Chandler Bing in that box, on the episode of Friends…

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Where he’s like, I have my reasons. They are three-fold. And he sticks his three fingers up out of the little holes in this box. I don’t remember what this whole story line was, but.

Liz Wolfe: I hated Friends when it was on, and I refused to watch it, but now every once in a while I catch episodes, and that was a funny show. It was a good show.

Diane Sanfilippo: It was really funny. Yep. It was a good one.

Liz Wolfe: Chandler Bing. What else? Updates for, these are for both of us. March 25th, which is just a few days from when this episode airs, you and I, Diane. You and me, Liz, are doing book talk nation, and that’s Tuesday at, what time?

Diane Sanfilippo: 7 p.m. eastern.

Liz Wolfe: 7 eastern. So, Book Talk Nation is basically a really good way to number 1, hang out with us a little bit virtually, live. And also to get a personalized sign copy of our books. You can order those through Book Talk Nation, and basically we’ll sign these books to you and get them out to you, it’s great for people that aren’t going to be able to make it to a signing. You know, I’m trying to put together a book tour, but it’s tough. So, we’re doing this to reach as many people as we possibly can.

Diane Sanfilippo: Indeed. And, the cool thing is, it supports our local independent book sellers.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: So the books aren’t sold from the online; Book Talk Nation isn’t an actual book seller, but what you and I will do is go to our local independent book stores, sign the books there, and it supports that independent book store. So we definitely want to shout out to all the indies and just make sure people know that it’s important to support those small businesses.

Liz Wolfe: Yes. Think, You’ve Got Mail. With Meg Ryan.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ohh, totally! The shop around the corner. Aww, I love it.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm. With Edith.

Diane Sanfilippo: I just watched it recently.

Liz Wolfe: I did too!

Diane Sanfilippo: F. O. S.

Liz Wolfe: With Edith from, what’s that movie, from All in the Family.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yes!

Liz Wolfe: Edith!

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s a really good movie. I mean, it’s so just, you know, classic Meg Ryan.

Liz Wolfe: That was like Meg Ryan on the cusp of too much Botox

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: and really over plucking her eyebrows, and too much lip injections. {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: But, it’s just the end of that era.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, but she’s still adorable.

Liz Wolfe: Tom Hanks, too.

Diane Sanfilippo: And When Harry Met Sally will still go down as one of my probably top 5 favorite, could watch it any time movies, so.

Liz Wolfe: Mmm. I love that movie.

Diane Sanfilippo: Have to give her that one.

Liz Wolfe: Did I talk about that movie on the podcast, the difference between South Orange and Haddonfield?

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I think you did.

Liz Wolfe: I think I did too. Love that part.

Diane Sanfilippo: We definitely talked about it. {laughs} I don’t know if it was on the podcast.

Liz Wolfe: I don’t remember either, but I remember being, I lived in Jersey so I get that line now! Like, the reason there’s no compatibility between Harry from Haddonfield and Princess Leia from South Orange.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Is because they’re completely different planets!

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: Anyway.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s like, Pennsyltucky and Philadelphia.

Liz Wolfe: I don’t know what that means. Pennsyltucky?

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s like western PA. Yeah, western PA.

Liz Wolfe: Pennsyltucky {laughs}.

Diane Sanfilippo: We call it Pennsyltucky.

Liz Wolfe: Punxsutawney?

Diane Sanfilippo: No. Pennsyltucky. Which, by the way, Orange is the New Black, they have a character, and the way they spell her name is Pennsatucky, but I’m like, No. It’s Pennsyltucky, like, Pennsylvania, but sort of merged with Kentucky. Because western PA is nothing like Philadelphia. And people are always like, oh isn’t Pittsburg really close to Philly? {laughs} You have to explain to them that it’s the equivalent of four other states away. It’s totally different. Anyway.

Liz Wolfe: Mmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: But we digress. What else is going on?

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Degenerating rapidly.

Diane Sanfilippo: Very rapidly! {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Our next event, you and I together next and last for the foreseeable future. I know we keep saying that, but it’s never for sure.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m always on the road,

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: So it’s just a matter of whether or not I can drag you with me.

Liz Wolfe: Whether or not I can pop in.

Diane Sanfilippo: For anybody who wonders, “Can we get them to go somewhere?” It’s pretty much {laughs} I pretty much never stay home for more than a couple of weeks. So yeah, anyway sorry go ahead.

Liz Wolfe: Diane will go. Liz might not go. Liz might stay and hang out with animals. Which, a lot of times I like better than people, really.

Diane Sanfilippo: With goats. Alright, where are we going, what are we doing?

Liz Wolfe: Denver, Saturday April 26. Everybody; we will be in Denver, Saturday April 26. Please come. Please come to Denver on Saturday, April 26 at the Tattered Cover. Bring Diane birthday presents that are edible and/or small and packable {laughs} because it’s going to be her; how old are you going to be?

Diane Sanfilippo: Nothing large or heavy.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m so grateful for everything; people have brought so many gifts along the way on the tour. Look, you don’t have to bring a gift, {laughs} I’m totally not saying that. Just keep in mind that there’s a packing weight limit, and I don’t normally allow a lot of extra space in my suitcase. So, people have given us some jars of things, and all kinds of things. I’m like, I have no where to put that! And I feel badly, because I want to love the stuff you give me, but if I can’t carry it home or consume within about 30 seconds… um, yeah. That all sounded really horrible and ungrateful.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s because I’m actually really grateful, and I’m the saddest person in the world when I’m like, this looks amazing! It’s a gigantic jar of something and I have to fly tomorrow.

Liz Wolfe: Gigantic jar of cod liver oil: I can’t take this all at once!

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing} Talk about overload.

Liz Wolfe: But this event will be fun, and we already have a ton of RSVPs. I will already be there for my sister’s bachelorette party, which we’re having in Denver, so I’m not promising sobriety or a lack of phallic, you know, clothing and accessories.

Diane Sanfilippo: Jewelry.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Liz will be carrying a straw that’s shaped like a phallus. {laughs} Anyway.

Liz Wolfe: Oh my gosh. If you Google Wichita bachelorette party and 6 foot inflatable hmm-mmm

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} You will come up with a shiny moment in my history.

Diane Sanfilippo: What does somebody get if they find you and the bachelorette party out that night? Do they get, like, I don’t know?

Liz Wolfe: Oh my gosh.

Diane Sanfilippo: A selfie with Liz or something?

Liz Wolfe: That’s a fun idea. We should come up with something.

Diane Sanfilippo: You should order; no. I was going to say you should order a drink that’s called a flip, but that’s egg whites. There’s no yolks in that. Anyway, what else? More updates? {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: That’s all I can think of for now. {laughs}

2. Eat Better Faster [10:52]

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok. I have a few updates, as we’ve; well, we’re only like 10 minutes in.

Liz Wolfe: We’re fine.

Diane Sanfilippo: I figure we get at least 15.

Liz Wolfe: People turn it off when we start answering questions.

Diane Sanfilippo: This would be my favorite part of the podcast.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: So, I want to say huge thanks to everyone who has been out in stores. And I think this is probably in large part due to the recent release of Practical Paleo in all Costco stores, but it made the weekly New York Times’ best seller list for, I think it’s now 3 weeks. And this isn’t something that a lot of people kind of know the ins and outs of. At this point, you know, I’m kind of really steeped in it with watching what the book is doing, and seeing what is going on out there, but it’s kind of blowing my mind that maybe it’s close to, what, 2 years later now, that the book has been out. A year and a half or so, and that list is just really, really tough to crack. There’s a couple of best seller lists, and one is a dining list. They’re all really tough to get on. There’s lots of janky stuff that kind of happens with these lists, where you’re like, how did that book get on the list randomly here or there, but it’s really tough to make. It’s really tough to make that monthly dining list, and it’s even harder to make the weekly list, and I’m just really… I’m just blown away. And I think it’s just so cool that people are able to use our books, you know, collectively, and Practical Paleo just so specifically at this point, to help other people. I just want to say thank you to everyone who is listening who has maybe purchased a copy or given away 10 copies {laughs} because I feel like people do that. So I just want to say thank you. And I think it’s awesome. And the fact that it’s been printed in the paper again recently is just cool. People who look through that stuff and are just kind of curious about what’s out there, just gives some really good exposure. Yeah, it’s cool stuff. So that’s that. I want to tell people a couple of things that are coming up. So, I worked recently for the past few months on a couple of new guides. And they’re only exclusively available as a part of a program from Jen Sinkler, who I don’t know if we’ve talked about her before on the podcast, but we may bring her on. Her website,, just the way it sounds. She has a Facebook page called Thrive as the Fittest. She’s a fitness guru, very well rounded in all different types of fitness, which I really like because as much as I’m a crossfitter and I love Crossfit, you know, there’s a million ways to train kettlebells, body weight, all different types of stuff. She’s pretty much a fitness connoisseur, so she’s taking certifications all the time, learning about all different techniques. She and her husband are in the Minneapolis, St. Paul area. They own a gym together and train all kinds of folks. Her new online program is called Lift Weights Faster. That’s kind of a joke about something, she was interviewed, I don’t know how long ago, but a reporter who at some point during the interview, said, “but what do you do for cardio?”

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: And she said, “I lift weights faster.”

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Which I love that, because it’s just so perfect. And I think I have a T-shirt of hers on in one of the videos I made where I burnt biscotti, if anybody hasn’t seen that one, it’s really good, watch it all the way to the end. My review of Beyond Bacon. Anyway, long story short, I wrote a guide called Eat Better Faster, and then a supplemental guide called Cook Meals Faster. In those guides; the Eat Better Faster guide actually has lots of tips and tricks. I pretty much wrote out what you would do for the entire day to plan your meal timing and nutrient timing; your carbs, fats, protein all that stuff around when your workout is. So I’ve got notes for breakfast; if you’re going to work out and it’s within this much time of waking up, it goes into a lot of detail and gives you a lot of different scenarios of when you’re training, what to do before, after, how to plan snacks depending on what time your meals are versus your workout and all of that. So, really cool, and it was a good chance for me to really sit down and kind of put a lot of information in one place. Lots of recipes in there. I think the guide ended up close to 80 pages. Recipes; if you guys have all my books, there’s going to be some repeat of recipes, obviously. I just can’t reinvent the wheel every time, but I do pull together from a lot of different resources, so if you have one of my books and not all of them, you’re going to get access to a bunch of recipes that are from everywhere. But a lot of the other content in that book is totally original, really cool stuff. Just useful. And then the Cook Meals Faster, same thing. Lots of tips and tricks. My top 10 meals that I cook quickly. I joke because my mom just is always like, you are the fastest cook on the planet. And literally, as I was finishing up this guide, she was over at my house for a minute, and then left and 10 minutes later she’s texting me and I sent her a picture of my meal, and she was just laughing, because she’s like, seriously. I don’t know anybody who cooks this fast. How do you do that? Anyway, I put my tips and tricks all in that guide. So, I’ve been posting on Facebook a little bit about it. If you’re on the emailing list, you’ll get something in your inbox soon. I’ll probably put up a blog post about it soon. But her program is going to be really, really comprehensive and cool. So, if you’re one of those people who doesn’t go to Crossfit, maybe, which I think probably more of you listening don’t than do, you want to find out how to train on your own, it’s basically this amazing program all put together for you. Again, the nutrition component is all from me. So, you can check that out. What else? PaleoFx. So, for folks who may be going to PaleoFx, I just wanted to let you know. Then event is, I think, April 11th, 12th, and 13th, and my talk will be on reintroducing non-paleo foods, which I think will be really fun to talk about. I only have 20 minutes, so I’m going to get into as much detail as I possibly can. I’m going to talking about what those foods are, when to either reintroduce them or not, what to look out for when reintroducing them, all that kind of stuff. So I think people are going to be really interested in hearing about all that, because most of the folks who come to PaleoFx are not totally new to paleo, so once you’ve been doing this a year, two, three, four, or more years, you really end up customizing things to your own needs and findings things that maybe weren’t “strict paleo” that work fine for you. So, I’m going to talk about that stuff. And I think that’s pretty much it. Did I lose you?

Liz Wolfe: No.

Diane Sanfilippo: Did you fall into the goat abyss.

Liz Wolfe: Is that a thing?

Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t know, is it?

Liz Wolfe: Because now I’m scared.

Diane Sanfilippo: Stirring my coffee.

Liz Wolfe: Like, really scared. Ok, well good.

Diane Sanfilippo: Well good.

Liz Wolfe: This is all very exciting.

Diane Sanfilippo: Hey, are you guys participating in the farm fit open over there?

Liz Wolfe: Yes. Yes we are. {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: What was 14.3 in farm fit? {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Digging out fence post holes with a post hole digger.

Diane Sanfilippo: For time? Do you do this for time?

Liz Wolfe: No. We do it for endurance.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Do it until your pinky finger gets pinched in between the posthole digger one too many times. And then you’re over it, and you have a big fight. And we don’t have to talk about it.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok. Well, I hope everyone who is actually participating in the Crossfit open, which I’m a member of that little tribe at this point. I don’t know that I’ll get to do the last workout, I’m going to be away and at this conference all day, and I do not do a 6 a.m. kind of deal, so.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Anyway. {laughs} I’m like, I might just miss that last workout. I hope they save the wall balls and the burpees for last. Anyway, anybody who is listening who did that, I hope you back is doing well. We deadlifted a whole bunch in this workout.

Liz Wolfe: Oh my gosh. That was a little painful to see some of the videos in my newsfeed with the back just rounding. It’s like {noise}

Diane Sanfilippo: I love my gym because it’s like a super motivating place to be, and it’s not a place you go to just kind of fool around. We’re serious about training and serious about having a good time, but there was a whole talk before the open workout commenced, and it was like, if we’re going to be on one trainer, JR, the owner, was actually on back patrol, he called it.

Liz Wolfe: Mm. Good.

Diane Sanfilippo: Where it was like, if he saw anybody just weakening up and not having good form, they were to stop. Because, you know, especially most of us in there are nowhere near qualifying for regionals. We’ve got probably at least 2 of our coaches who might actually go to regionals, and you know, it’s a different story if you’re at that point and that one more rep actually does matter and your form is just not beautiful but it might really make a difference. Obviously not to the point of you getting hurt; nobody is trying to get hurt. But they were just, we’re calling people, we’re not pushing people. So I was really glad about that.

Liz Wolfe: I’m happy to have kind of discovered, not kind of discovered. To have discovered Katy Bowman’s work, because different types of exercise and movement resonate more with different people.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yes.

Liz Wolfe: And I am so at home with just integrating different things all throughout the day. Which I know you do as well.

Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t do it that well. I think your new lifestyle of having the homestead definitely allows for that a lot better, don’t you think?

Liz Wolfe: Yes. But it also has made me feel ok with kind of this weird schizo tendency I would have to break out in to dance.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Or just to like, wallow around on the floor, just at random intervals. Because now I’ll do handstands, or different yoga type holds, or I’ll just run outside and do some squats, or I’ll dance to conga or something goofy.

Diane Sanfilippo: Do like a Chinese fire drill around your house?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Just run around your house, outside, and your neighbors who are so far away can’t even see you.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Pretty much. I really like to represent that.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Because I think that you and I have some good polarity going here, where it’s like, it’s ok to take a walk and just mess around with some movement because there really is no one way to be fit and healthy. There are a ton of different ways, and it doesn’t mean

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Crushing yourself every day. It doesn’t mean not crushing yourself every day.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: You really can have a high level of fitness doing things that we maybe haven’t been educated towards in the past.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: So, I like it.

Diane Sanfilippo: I had somebody on Instagram who, somehow she felt badly that she didn’t do or want to do Crossfit.

Liz Wolfe: No.

Diane Sanfilippo: I was like, I’m not trying to make you feel badly. This is just what I’m doing. I have no agenda for people to all be crossfitting. Especially if there is not a place near you that is a really well run establishment. So, yeah, I’m all for different types of movement. I’ve always been kind of a little bit of a competitive athlete. That’s part of a little bit of my psyche and part of who I am. If I don’t have any of that or that team element going on, where, you know with Crossfit you get to have the individual competition, just with yourself. And you also get the team environment of the classes and the group and all that. So, for me, it works well emotionally and physically, if that makes sense.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm. You have to like what you’re doing.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: From an emotional standpoint. Mental standpoint, as well.

Diane Sanfilippo: It has to be fun, I think. And I’m alone all day for the most part now, so for me, to go to a class. I just need it! {laughs} I need to not be socially awkward because I haven’t interacted with people for 72 hours, other than over the internet.

Liz Wolfe: {Snorts} I need to not be socially awkward.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s making me more introverted, though. This whole, working in isolation a lot. I’ve become way more introverted for the 99% of my life that isn’t a live event, because at live events, I’m good to talk to 100 people or whatever it is. Anyway.

Liz Wolfe: Well, it’s because all day long. See, this is the thing.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Introverts will understand this. My husband goes to work and he interacts with people all day. For a while it was hard for him to understand why I’m home all day, you know, supposedly not interacting with other human people, and yet I still don’t want to go out to dinner or I don’t want to, you know, plan to do something with a group of people. But it is because we are literally interacting with people all day long, from the beginning of the day until we go to bed. It never stops, it’s just through the internet. So, that is just as socially exhausting, in my opinion, as actually being somewhere.

Diane Sanfilippo: Thank you for qualifying that. I feel a lot better about it now.

Liz Wolfe: I’m just saying.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok, good.

Liz Wolfe: It makes sense to me.

Diane Sanfilippo: Whoo! 23 and change.

Liz Wolfe: Oh my goodness. Ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: Alright.

3. Egg-cerpt from Eat the Yolks [24:11]

Liz Wolfe: I’m going to read a really fast paragraph from Eat the Yolks, because I don’t want people to forget that I have a book that’s out, and we need to get it on some list somewhere. Let’s get it on ..

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s on my list.

Liz Wolfe: Let’s get it on the New York Examiner.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s on my top bathroom reading list, what are you talking about?

Liz Wolfe: Let’s get it on whatever list Carrie Bradshaw, you know, whatever magazine or TV show that was. Let’s get it on that list. The New York Examiner. I really like how the dog.

Diane Sanfilippo: What is that?

Liz Wolfe: Hey, sweetheart?

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: Can you put the dog in a different room? {laughs} Ok. Thanks honey. Everybody say high to my husband.

Mr. Wolfe: Hi husband.

Liz Wolfe: Hi.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing} He said hi to himself.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Classic.

Liz Wolfe: Classic. Alright, here is the paragraph, and then we will get to questions.

I advocate real food from sources that raise, grow, or catch it right. That’s it. Even so, this isn’t an all or nothing manifesto. Start where you can when you can, and do the best you can. Just start. Because the world of supermarket jargon is only getting more confusing, the world of industrial pesticides more poisonous, and the problem of soil depletion more insidious. The important thing is that you start, and once you start, keep on going.


Diane Sanfilippo: Love it.

Liz Wolfe: Loves it!

Diane Sanfilippo: I saw; this is so random. I used to live in San Francisco, as most people here know. Chris LaLanne has one of the Crossfit gyms there, and he posted something on Facebook about; he went on the Steve Harvey show a couple of years ago, and I think helped somebody start eating paleo, and she had this 21-day video diary of her “paleo diet.” I think Chris is connected with Loren Cordain, as well, so he teaches the kind of really strict version of it. But it was really cool, because literally you could see her transformation over just 3 weeks. But, by the end, she was like, “so, I don’t really think there’s anything I’m going to do that differently tomorrow, and I don’t really consider this a diet at this point. It’s definitely a lifestyle and” you know, she just kind of got it by the end. I thought that was a really cool. I don’t know what you said that just made me think of that. I’m already too tired to remember three thoughts in a row.

Liz Wolfe: Well, good thing it’s time to help people with important health questions.

Diane Sanfilippo: I think we should maybe start to get over the fact that the questions are the good part? I think the rest of it’s the good part, don’t you?

Liz Wolfe: I do too. This is what I like.

Diane Sanfilippo: Alright, maybe we’ll answer some questions this week. That’s what we should say. Maybe we’ll get to some questions.

Liz Wolfe: Why not?

Diane Sanfilippo: If we’re lucky. Alright. We’ll answer some questions.

4. High Cholesterol; so, what can I eat? [26:51]

Liz Wolfe: Alright. This one is from Brittney. High Cholesterol; so, what can I eat? “My doc just called with my most recent lab results, and said my cholesterol levels were way too high. Her list of foods to avoids were: Organ meats, red meats, chicken skin, butter, coconut oil, bacon, bacon fat, egg yolks, and I was so excited for Liz’s new book, and fast food. “ On what planet is fast food…

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: In the same category as all of these other foods that have been food for thousands of years.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s ridiculous.

Liz Wolfe: Agggh. Ok, Brittany continues. “Well, you’ll never catch me getting fast food, but the rest of the list are things I eat weekly, if not daily. So my question is, what can I eat? I felt like crying when I heard the news. I eat paleo about 90% of the time. A typical day for me looks like eggs and bacon for breakfast, leftover meats for lunch with usually a small kale salad and Tessamae’s dressing, dinner is typically protein heavy with steak or chicken and roasted veggies. I use grass fed butter nearly every time I cook. I do not eat gluten or soy; I’m allergic to both. I do Crossfit three times per week, sometimes more. I sleep 8 hours a night. I take fermented cod liver oil daily, although I haven’t taken any in the last month. “

Diane Sanfilippo: It sounds like the dog’s not happy.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, I’m sorry.

Diane Sanfilippo: With the decision to put him in another room {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: The dog is upset about grouping fast food in the same group with organ meats, red meats, chicken skin, butter, coconut oil, bacon, bacon fat, and egg yolks. Brittany, please do read my book, because it’s going to make you feel a lot better about what’s going on. Diane, what are your thoughts on this question?

Diane Sanfilippo: So, quickly my thoughts here. One thing that we had in her original question that somehow didn’t make it into this is that her one thing that she put in here that was non-paleo was wine 3 times a week. I’m just going to throw it out there, and {laughs} I know that people hate it when I’m anti-alcohol, but if you do have an issue where you’re concerned about cholesterol being high; maybe, maybe it’s really high. We don’t even know. We don’t actually have her lab tests. Alright, let me start over. A few things going on here; one, we don’t even know if your cholesterol level is actually high.

Liz Wolfe: Right.

Diane Sanfilippo: It may be high for your doctor’s numbers that are just given as a level so that they can then recommend a prescription drug so that they can change that level. There isn’t just a set number of when you are over this number, you are now not a healthy person. People need to understand; and I know you’ll be able to talk a little bit more about this too. And I know your book gets into it a lot. We need cholesterol; it’s not something to be scared of. If your cholesterol levels are elevated. So, let’s just say they are pretty high. Let’s just say; for me, high for a female would be somewhere over probably 250 or 260. I’d want to see what the breakdown is. Is your LDL 200 or higher, and your HDL is not making up a large percentage of that? So if your LDL is around 200 or more, it could be a sign that you have a thyroid issue. This is information I’ve collected up from folks like Chris Kresser and Dr. Thomas Dayspring talking about what goes on with cholesterol and reasons why it can elevate. Cholesterol levels in the body will be where they need to be to deal with what’s going on in your body. So, if there’s a lot of stress in your system for some reason, it may elevate your cholesterol. If there’s a malfunction with some of your organs, if your thyroid is not working properly, if something is going on, cholesterol levels may increase to deal with that stress. So anything that is out of balance in the body is a stressor, and cholesterol may rise for that. So, if your cholesterol is actually high; so again, I would say, those numbers that I just mentioned, it means do some more digging to find out why they are that level. So, that being said, my guess is that it’s just over 200. That isn’t actually even high. I would recommend listening to some interviews between Chris Kresser and Chris Masterjohn talking about average cholesterol levels for females. Anywhere from 2-240 as a total might be totally normal or healthy. Below 150 might be no healthy for women, just because we have lots of hormones to make, and cholesterol is a hormone precursor for us. You have to understand that the cholesterol you eat barely affects the cholesterol in your blood. Barely. So about half of 1% is how much the cholesterol you eat might affect what your total cholesterol is. Now, saturated fat in the diet can increase HDL cholesterol, which is typically what your doctor sees as the “good cholesterol”. If you are eating more egg yolks, and coconut oil, and saturated fats from well-raised animal sources. That will probably raise your HDL cholesterol. That’s not a bad thing; that’s a good thing. What happens with the total of your cholesterol is going to balance out between the foods you eat that may support cholesterol production, and your body’s own innate cholesterol production. So, what that means is, if you actually eat foods that support cholesterol production, it kind of gives your body a bit of a break. So, you’ll see, and maybe Liz you might have some more numbers when I kind of wrap up rambling, on the difference between those who eat animal foods and those who don’t and their cholesterol numbers, because we know we can’t eat cholesterol unless we’re eating animal food. So a lot of people who go animal foods free, which is what I’m calling it because I don’t really like saying the words vegan or vegetarian, because people get all heated, but animals foods free. If you don’t eat any animal foods, you could still have a high cholesterol number. It’s not a great panacea for just reducing cholesterol, and reducing cholesterol in and of itself doesn’t solve problems. It might actually take away part of the solution to the problem. So, there’s a lot of things at play here. I would say we definitely don’t know enough about what her numbers are doing. I would say that LDL number is important to look at. Your fasting glucose is important to look at. Is your fasting glucose number high, or not? And your triglycerides high? And when I say high, I mean probably over 75. Your doc may see 150 as a healthy number; really closer to 100 or below, and probably even 75 or below is what we typically see with a paleo type of diet, regardless of carb intake. So, some people think you have to eat really low carb to get those down, but you don’t necessarily. You just need to eat the good carbs, not the bad carbs. Those are going to be much better indicators of issues with overall health and what’s going on with cholesterol numbers. The only other thing I want to say here is, because some people do ask these questions and they want to basically appease their doctor with their next visit. Right? You’re just like, what can I do to get it to a place that might be lower. So, you might not be able to do anything. You might do “everything right”, you might do what this doctor tells you to do, you might get rid of all of those foods, and your cholesterol comes back exactly the same. Because your body needs it to be where it needs to be to deal with whatever is going on. So, if there’s something stressful going on in your body, if you’re a stressed out person, when I was working on Practical Paleo , I’ve talked about this a million times, my cholesterol was a little higher. I wasn’t concerned or confused about that. I understood fully that I was very, very stressed at the time. I think Gary Taubes even talked about that when he went on Dr. Oz right after he released Why We Get Fat and What to do About it. He didn’t want to get his cholesterol tested because he was under a lot of stress at the time. So he knew it was going to come back reflecting that. So, those are things to keep in mind. If you do want to do something to see if you can move that number, you could reduce the amount of saturated fat you eat for about a month and do the test again, so you’d focus on the “PC fats”, I say this in air quotes. So things like avocado, and olive oil, which we love, but we know that they’re not the only healthy fats out there. But you could do this. There are some people who are like, well I have an insurance issue going on, and I need to get these numbers down for insurance purposes. Or who knows. I don’t think that’s the case with Brittany, just throwing it out there. You could do that, and you could increase your fiber from lots of different vegetable and plant sources and see what that does. That will help your body to clear whatever is going on, and just kind of help your eliminations, which can also help with just detoxifying and give your liver a little bit of support. And onto the liver. She’s drinking wine 3 times a week. I don’t know if that means one glass 3 times a week, or 3 times a week, a few glasses. Anything you do that puts more pressure on your liver to detoxify is going to impair your cholesterol levels. So, whether that means it’s going to raise them, which is the most likely case, or lower them for a negative reason, we need to give our liver the best chance possible of dealing with our metabolism and our cholesterol and all of that stuff. So, if you’re looking at getting this stuff improved, drinking wine 3 times a week might not be the best way to do that. I’m not saying if you are a healthy person it’s making you unhealthy, but if you’re concerned about cholesterol levels, remember that when you drink, the first thing your liver needs to do and take care of is detoxifying that alcohol. So, if you’ve got other goals going on, that’s what you’re giving your liver to handle first, if that’s what’s happening. That’s enough from me. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Ok. {laughs} I just hate. I hate cholesterol. I hate all of it.

Diane Sanfilippo: You hate this for her, right?

Liz Wolfe: I hate it for her. And I hate that … I hate that it doesn’t mean what we think it means, and yet we still use it as this primary indicator for how we’re doing. It’s just dumb.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s horrible.

Liz Wolfe: It’s BS. It sucks!

Diane Sanfilippo: I wish people didn’t know their cholesterol levels.

Liz Wolfe: Me too.

Diane Sanfilippo: Because it does very little for 99.9% of the people to tell you whether or not you’re healthy. There’s a very, very small percentage of the population for whom it may be a useful marker. Right?

Liz Wolfe: Right.

Diane Sanfilippo: Like, if somebody didn’t know they had a thyroid thing going, and they realize that the LDL is really high. Or if somebody doesn’t realize they have familial hypercholesterolemia, and the first time they get it tested, it’s like, wow. My cholesterol is 600. That can be interesting, and relevant important information. For 99.9% of the population, you know if you’re a healthy person. Triglycerides, I think, are a much better number to look at. I think we can tell from triglycerides somebody who looks healthy on the outside who inside really isn’t. And I’ve told this story many times before, too. I had a coworker who was probably in her early to mid 20s. Looked healthy, by all accounts from the outside. Slender shape, and alert {laughs} you know, all the good physical signs from the outside, which I think again for 99.9% of people can be a really, how do you look and feel? You know, what’s going on. But when she got her triglycerides measured, they were over 250. And she ate a really junky diet. Very high, refined carbohydrate, poor food quality, just really not the best food. So, at that point it’s an interesting marker just to say, hey, you don’t just have a good healthy metabolism that’s keeping the fat off your bum, it’s actually now circulating in your bloodstream, and that makes you less healthy than the person with the bigger butt, unfortunately for you.

Liz Wolfe: Ooh-ooh! Big Butts!

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I’ve seen some pictures of myself lately, and.

Liz Wolfe: It’s like a shelf.

Diane Sanfilippo: Bootylicious.

Liz Wolfe: It’s like a shelf in the back.

Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t know where it’s coming from. Nobody in my family. Squats for days.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: Anyway, so I do think it’s interesting in that case. So if Brittany says her cholesterol is over 300, and her triglycerides are close to 200 or higher, that’s when it gets interesting. That’s when there’s something going on there. Otherwise, just get a new doctor, man.

Liz Wolfe: That’s what I’m saying. Get a new doctor. Let’s remember; this is what my whole book is about, right? How we got here in the first place. Because when we know that, it’s a lot easier to accept that something doesn’t mean what we thing it means. We started testing cholesterol, in the first place, because it was easy! It was just a really easy lab measure to take. And so all of a sudden, it took on all this meaning that was completely misplaced, and then, you know, as much as we have these incredibly brilliant doctors. Dayspring, who I cite in my book, all these people who are trying to give the true meaning of blood lipid profiles and things like that, it still remains that it just doesn’t have the significance that modern day to day medicine is placing upon it. And I think it sucks that people have to worry about these things when they’re just not…

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: Just not worth it. But that’s just me. And again, disclaimer at the beginning; rewind, review, move on.

Diane Sanfilippo: Whoo!

Liz Wolfe: Ooh. Ok. Next one.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, wait.

Liz Wolfe: what.

Diane Sanfilippo: One more thing then.

Liz Wolfe: Ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: I just want to remind people we actually, and maybe I, talk a lot about cholesterol in the online workshop. So all of this stuff that I just kind of went over that you can read over again in the transcript and all that, I’ll be explaining that to all of you in the workshop in a little bit more of an organized way with visuals and all that good stuff. So if you’re like, I heard what you said, I don’t quite remember it or get it. That’s where you’ll be able to come in and learn all that stuff. I’ve explained this thing probably 50 times to people, so I can. That’s where you’ll be able to get that information again a little bit more clearly, get some numbers and information to kind of look over and track. Ok. Just wanted to remind people of that.

5. Happy liver dude. Paleo on, Wayne! Paleo on, Garth! [40:44]

Liz Wolfe: Cool. Alright, next up. Happy liver dude. Paleo on, Wayne! Paleo on, Garth! Ms. M asks, “thank you for the information you’ve shared. It’s helped me so much. In the last year, I’ve dropped 75 pounds, and have 50 more to go. I’m 5’8”, and I think 160 is a good goal for me. My question is I have HAE, that’s hereditary angioedema, a rare genetic disorder that limits the amount of C1 protein made by the liver. This causes swelling attacks that are very painful. HAE has a 40% death rate if you have an attack in the neck involving the airway. It also has reactions with estrogen. I have had two-thirds reduction in swelling attacks. I’m unsure what’s happening, but it may be that my liver not being overwhelmed with a SAD diet now, it can work better for me. Or is it the removal of reactive hormones, estrogen, dairy, soy. I try to limit plastic. These can be a trigger. There are very few treatments, so seeing a reduction in attacks is a big deal. Doctors have very few helpful ideas besides steroids that don’t work, or experimental drugs. When I say this way of eating is helping, it is dismissed. I’m told I’m just in a lull of attacks, and it’s not diet related. I’m in the market for a new doctor. My question is, do you have liver boosting ideas, what are foods or minerals that make a happy liver. Paleo on, Wayne! Paleo on, Garth!” Alright, so this could be a dicey question if I try to speak directly to her condition, but I’m not going to do that, because that’s just shaky territory. But, number one, I want to say that changing the diet away from a SAD diet, which is overburdening to your bodies detoxification capacities, is 100% possibly affecting in enabling your body to work better. And this is something, you know, I think this whole paleo autoimmune sector that’s growing thanks to the work of Sarah Ballantyne. I think this is an example of people exploring the science behind why a paleo approach works for diseases that were previously considered just completely incurable or medically unapproachable or just basically medical mysteries. So, when you have something that is as serious as this, or as serious as anything, tackling the diet and getting in nourishing foods, it’s not a surprise to me that you see improvement that is unexplainable in conventional channels. Obviously, cannot speak to this condition. And I’m also going to say, because there is something going on here that specifically affects the liver, I will not proffer any advice whatsoever about supporting the liver, because the traditional things that I would say for somebody who just wanted to support their liver nutritionally, I just don’t know given a liver issue how that would affect this person. So, I would actually caution Ms. M to not take my advice, but I will say a few things about supporting a healthy liver, or supporting your liver’s detoxification pathways. I personally take milk thistle now and then in different tinctures, digestive tinctures. I like ginger a lot, some turmeric. Just basically some herbal solutions to support the liver. And then eating liver, as well, is really supportive to your liver, as well as not overburdening your body with more carbohydrates than it can handle. I think that’s pretty much it. There are a lot of things that you can do to support your liver, but when I think it comes to a kind of puzzling medical condition, that’s really something you have to keep shopping for a doctor, find one you like, and then you can tackle this specifically with regards to your condition once you find somebody you trust.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, and I think when it comes to liver supportive nutrients, we always like the food-based versions, because they’ll be rich in certain nutrients, but in balance with others.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: That includes, as you’re talking about, ginger, that could be ginger that’s fresh or incorporated into your cooking in any way or it could be a ginger tea. Same thing with milk thistle. It’s an herbal supplement, but you could actually drink a milk thistle tea, and that might be supportive and in a gentle but effective way. Most people who seek to get really big, sort of intense doses or very intensely therapeutic benefits from certain teas, they drink a lot of them every day versus a little bit of it here and there to just do what you can to be supportive. And just making sure you’re getting very nutrient rich foods, because we know that magnesium is one thing that a lot of people, it seems to be a mineral that if it’s not in balance, it can cause a lot of different issues. So I’m not saying go out and supplement with magnesium, but I am saying seek out magnesium-rich foods.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: And eat those. So I think a lot of the stuff I have in Practical Paleo, I don’t have a specific plan that’s intended for liver support, although the blood sugar regulation plan might have some supplements that you can just read about what some of these different supplements do. There’s probably a handful in there that are supportive of liver and detox, as well as in some of the other meal plans. So, you’ve just got to read what they do. You can also then flip the page and find out what foods you will find those nutrients in. So that’s really kind of the important thing to focus on there.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

6. Do I really have to give up my gum? [46:23]

Liz Wolfe: Next up. Do I really have to give up my gum? Jenna asks, “Hi Diane! Thanks so much for providing such an awesome book, blog, etc. I’m loving all the info. Quick question; I’ll officially begin The 21-Day Sugar Detox next month, but I realized yesterday I’ve cut out everything on the no list except for wheat; I eat one piece of Ezekiel about 2 times a week; wine, my in-laws are in town,” {laughing}, “and gum. Just in preparation for the detox. I feel amazing. It’s been 6 days, I’ve not had any sugar except 2 drops of stevia extract in my morning tea, which will go away for the detox, as well. My question is, given that I’ve already been pretty successful at giving up the sweet stuff, do I have to quit gum for 21 days? I’m dying about that one. Avid gum chewer at work; I just wasn’t sure how imperative that was. If you have any chance to get back to me, that would be great. Silly question; maybe you get it a lot, but I thought I’d ask. I want to do this the right way. Thanks for all you do; I think this is going to change my life.” What’s up with the gum, D?

Diane Sanfilippo: Well. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Weeeellll.

Diane Sanfilippo: You know, do I have to give up my gum for 21 days? Well, no, but you don’t have to do the 21-Day Sugar Detox {laughs} either.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: So, I mean, if you’re doing the detox, yes, you have to give up your gum.

Liz Wolfe: You’re so bossy!

Diane Sanfilippo: Ooohh, boy oh boy. Look, the program exists the way it exists for a certain reason. I absolutely think you can benefit from the principles of it, a lot of the ideas, the recipes. Do what you want to do, but in order to achieve the multifaceted beneficial results, one of which is really changing the way your palate works around the sweet taste, you’re not going to do that if your chewing gum. Especially if you’re an avid gum-chewer at work. And I have to tell you, I was the same way. I used to have a drawer filled with at least 3 or 4 kinds of gum all the time. I used to chew lots of different sugarless gums. I would go to Target and buy 6-packs of 6, and just have a drawer stuffed with it. And I honestly, we’ve talked about this recently too, I don’t remember the last time I really chewed gum. I maybe had a mint here or there. So, it’s a big question we get, what do I do instead? Some people have recommended chewing on beeswax. Some people have recommended chewing on little pieces of cinnamon stick. I usually recommend sipping on mint tea, pretty much all day, if you want to freshen your breath, or just other types of herbal tea, which you can do hot or iced. Or, you know, the spa water thing where you’re putting lemon or lime in your water, or cucumbers, that kind of thing, so that you have a flavor and something to keep your hands and your mouth occupied a little bit if you’re at work and you just kind of want something to do that. But, no you can’t have gum {laughs} on the 21-Day Sugar Detox. I’m sorry. And, you know, the truth here is that the vast majority of gums people are chewing, they are sweetened with artificial sweeteners. So, I don’t want anybody putting that stuff in their pie hole. {laughs} I do not want aspartame going into your mouth. There are a handful of gum companies out there who use either xylitol, which I’m still not really a huge fan of, or they’ll use just a little bit of cane sugar or something like, and you know down the road if you want to invest in that, I think Lee gum is one of them. As a gum chewer, I just was not really enjoying it. It just was not the same to me. But, I will tell you this. You will probably get over. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: We have hundreds if not thousands of people who have given up gum. And then, go back and read the ingredients and what you’re actually putting into your mouth. So, it really changes things. As much as I don’t like the idea of something like Ezekiel bread, just because I think it’s filler and taking the place of more nutrient dense foods, it’s made from real ingredients, and not junky stuff. Whereas gum is really a bunch of synthetic chemicals put together to be appealing to us. My other kind of issue with chewing gum is that what you do by chewing is prime your digestive system for food, and I don’t think it’s a good idea to be chewing all day. I just don’t. I think it’s a good idea to chew when you’re eating, and chew your food well, but I don’t think it’s a good idea to send that signal to your brain and your stomach all day long. So, there’s that. Sorry Jenna. I’m sorry.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} I’m sorry.

Diane Sanfilippo: #sorryImnotsorry.

Liz Wolfe: Oh my. Ok. Let’s do one more question.

Diane Sanfilippo: Let’s go down to, oh, I don’t know if I have a name on it. Let me see if there’s a name on this one.

Liz Wolfe: Which one.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ohh, she didn’t put a name. I’m going to guess that …

Liz Wolfe: Does that preclude her question?

Diane Sanfilippo: Nope. No, but do I need to eat meat?

Liz Wolfe: Let’s call her Patty. {laughs} You know, like burger patty? {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Ha ha ha.

7. Do I need to eat meat? [51:43]

Liz Wolfe: Alright. “Hello Diane and Liz. Love the podcast. I’ve been working my way backwards through all the episodes, and thoroughly enjoying it. I’m about halfway through. I basically listen to it all the time. Going for walks, cooking, cleaning, driving, and the list goes on. I quickly searched your website to see if you had answered this question before, and did not see anything, so I apologize if you’ve already addressed this topic. I’ve been completely paleo for just under 6 months. Prior to that, I had been gluten free, dairy free, and processed food free for about a year. I started eating this way for a variety of vague problems; skin problems, headaches, lethargy, pretty bad anxiety and panic attacks, brain fog, tired even when I got plenty of sleep, and lots of stomach aches. During that year, I felt better, but not as good as I thought I could, and I just naturally started finding myself eating more and more paleo in an effort to feel better. So far, I love it, feeling great. The only problems that persist are the headaches, although much better and less severe than before, still getting afternoon tiredness some days around 4 p.m., acne around my mouth, chin, and jaw. I never had any skin problems until I was about 23-24; 28 now. Side note, I’m 5’9”, and my weight has consistently been 130-140 since high school. So everything I eat is paleo; however, I do not like to call myself paleo, which is why it is in quotes above, because I do not eat any meat or poultry. Therefore, I feel like my diet is not in the spirit of paleo. I’ve been a pescatarian for so long, about 15 years, which is more than half my life, I’m 28 now, that I’m having trouble getting comfortable with the idea of incorporating meat and poultry into my diet. It’s not really a moral dilemma, but rather I’ve never thought it was necessary. I do not miss meat or poultry at all, nor is it something I ever crave. However, the more and more I get into all my paleo books and blogs, and your podcast, I’m feeling like I should try it out. The question is, by not eating any meat or poultry, what do you think my body is lacking? Thanks ladies. Keep up the great work.” So, just as …

Diane Sanfilippo: Whoo.

Liz Wolfe: You want the details a little bit?

Diane Sanfilippo: No, I think we’re good. I think she’s covered it all.

Liz Wolfe: If I could do another quick pitch for my book.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: My book is really about what animal foods provide for us, down to the nitty gritty. From the very specific nutrients to the types of fats and the types of amino acids. So, I think that is probably, if she’s enjoying listening to us, then perhaps she would also enjoy reading my words for an extended period of time.

Diane Sanfilippo: Can I give you; I’m going to give her a couple of notes, and then if you have more you want to throw in, because you might have some more. Because she is talking about a handful of problems here, really.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: The only problems that persist, they are pretty legit problems.

Liz Wolfe: But, it’s a lot better than where she was before.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Which I think it’s cool that she’s recognized that something’s going on, so pushing the changes gradually and seeing improvement,

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: There’s no reason she can’t keep going. We just have to give her a reason to do so.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. I think gradual change is fine. And I do think that, for the most part. Like, I can for the most part support a pescatarian approach because I do think you’re getting most of what would be critical. The couple of nutrients that I’m going to call out that you may not be getting in abundance without red meat specifically, but I could be wrong on one of them. Or two. Well, I’ll tell you what I think. {laughs} So, zinc is huge. Right? We know that zinc is a huge contributor to the health of a lot of things, but I think our skin health is something that zinc is really supportive of. And you can tell me if I’m totally off on that, but I think you’ve probably talked about that a bunch. I don’t know if she’s eating lots of oysters; they can be quite cost prohibitive, although you can get them smoked and in a little tin, and you won’t lose any of the minerals by eating them cooked or whatever. Whatever kind of treatment they’ve gone through, or sauces, or whatever is going on with the oysters. So I would definitely say if you’re not eating foods that are rich in zinc, and this is again one of those times where, you know, we’re not all about calorie counting and all that, but maybe there’s a nutrient calculator you might just want to run your diet through that and see. If you’ve got certain nutrients that you literally are never eating foods that are rich in those, that’s when you can make a call and say, oh, maybe I should pick up some of those foods. Again, Practical Paleo I list out lots of different supportive nutrients for all different issues going on in the body and where you can find them in foods. You know, we’re always going to recommend food first. But red meat is going to be rich in B vitamins; obviously liver is very rich in B vitamins. Also rich in zinc. And red meat will be rich in a huge complex of B vitamins. It’s something that I don’t know that you’re going to get the same thing without eating those proteins. Also, the different balance of amino acids you get from land animals versus sea animals. So, there could be a pretty big difference there. I wouldn’t necessarily throw a huge fit about trying to eat poultry. I’m a little bit indifferent. I eat chicken because I enjoy it and it’s just one of those things to kind of change things up a bit, but it’s not one of those meats where I would really say you’re missing much by not eating it. I think that red meat probably holds a little bit of a higher standard in terms of something that might be worth incorporating. And it doesn’t mean multiple times a week, tons of it. It just might mean a couple of times a week, a little bit. I think a little bit might be able to go along way. That’s kind of my thoughts there. When it comes to the acne around the mouth/chin/jaw, we know that can be really hormonally driven. So, to toot the horn of Liz’s other project, {laughs} The Skintervention Guide, I would definitely look into what’s going on there with some other shifts in nutrition that can support hormonal balance. But, what are you washing your face with? Are you oil cleansing or really kind of still using some less natural types of cleansers and potions and all that. And then, when she talked about the other food that she’s eating, she said some nuts and nut butters. Nuts we know can really cause some issues with acne. I know I’m kind of focusing on that one, but in terms of the fatigue, it’s really tough to say. The fatigue and the headaches; this could be really driven more by issues around sleep than specific food choices, but I think her sleep could even be affected by some of those food choices, too. And again, magnesium would be another one to make sure you’re really getting a good balance of there.

Liz Wolfe: I like everything that you said, and I don’t have a whole lot to add, except for to stress a couple of relationships between nutrients that are probably not

Diane Sanfilippo: Yes.

Liz Wolfe: Really working for her right now. So, zinc and vitamin A, which are just pally-pals. Zinc and vitamin A together, which occur in red meat, are really, really critical from everything from vision to the way your skin keratinizes. So it has to do with skin health, systemic health, zinc and vitamin A together is really, really important. Beyond that, zinc needs to be in balance with copper, and when you’re not getting enough zinc but you’re eating a lot of plant foods and a lot of copper rich foods, you can end up with a little bit of a copper-zinc imbalance, and that can be a problem. The sulfur-containing amino acids are also important, along with the easily available iron. But, it’s just one of those things where if you’re still looking for some healing and you’re still looking for some changes, it’s time to give it a try. But other than that, you’ve pretty much covered everything. I don’t know, what am I missing here? The dark chocolate probably needs to go for the headache situation.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Right, the high-arginine foods.

Diane Sanfilippo: You’ve just taken away her joy.

Liz Wolfe: I know.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, usually is fermented.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, see if you can enjoy, what is that kind of chocolately type stuff?

Diane Sanfilippo: Carob?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Is that any good?

Diane Sanfilippo: It actually isn’t bad. In my day, I’ve been known to create some pretty interesting things using carob, because I’m in a moment.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} In your day.

Diane Sanfilippo: I can mix anything remotely seeming like dessert into something {laughs} pretty well seeming like dessert.

Liz Wolfe: Oh, yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

Liz Wolfe: I liked this question though. And I liked how she, I liked the manner in which she asked it. I think it’s a really good question.

Diane Sanfilippo: So what did we tackle, like 2 questions today?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, pretty much.

Diane Sanfilippo: One, two. Oh boy. You guys. We love you.

Liz Wolfe: We do. It’s a true story. So I guess we’re done, huh?

Diane Sanfilippo: I think so.

Liz Wolfe: Ok. So, I’ll read the ending now. {laughs} That’s everything. We’ll be back next week with, I believe it will be my interview with Stephanie Ruper. Her book, Sexy By Nature, is phenomenal. Absolutely love it. If you enjoyed our talk about body image, movements, exercise, anything specific to women, you will love this book, and I love Stephanie. So, that will be next week. If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please help us spread the word by leaving a review in iTunes. Until next week, you can find Diane at, and you can find me, Liz, at Thanks for listening.

Diane & Liz


  • Abigail Smith

    After hearing about the exhaustion related to keeping up with internet communication and social media towards the middle of the podcast, I was reminded of this clip from Portlandia. Hope you enjoy!

    • balancedbites


  • Abigail Smith

    After hearing about the exhaustion related to keeping up with internet communication and social media towards the middle of the podcast, I was reminded of this clip from Portlandia. Hope you enjoy!

  • Dr Jeff Matheson

    When are we going to stop this madness and stop measuring cholesterol. Cholesterol is not the problem, inflammation is. Japan has stopped measuring cholesterol and in France, a 60,000 patient study had a three word conclusion “cholesterol is harmless”. We are inundated by propaganda from big pharma and it influences everything us doctors tell you. It’s sickening that the system we have created does not promote health but promotes chronic illness. We are on a terrible course, diabetes and heart disease are in epidemic proportions with the collusion (maybe unknowingly) of the food industry and big pharma. Get back to whole, unprocessed foods, it is amazing the difference.

    • balancedbites

      It is quite maddening, isn’t it? :-/ I have a very hard time wrapping my head around being forced to participate in the “health care” system and purchasing insurance (which I haven’t in many years). We are with you here Dr. Jeff!

  • Dr Jeff Matheson

    When are we going to stop this madness and stop measuring cholesterol. Cholesterol is not the problem, inflammation is. Japan has stopped measuring cholesterol and in France, a 60,000 patient study had a three word conclusion “cholesterol is harmless”. We are inundated by propaganda from big pharma and it influences everything us doctors tell you. It’s sickening that the system we have created does not promote health but promotes chronic illness. We are on a terrible course, diabetes and heart disease are in epidemic proportions with the collusion (maybe unknowingly) of the food industry and big pharma. Get back to whole, unprocessed foods, it is amazing the difference.

    • balancedbites

      It is quite maddening, isn’t it? :-/ I have a very hard time wrapping my head around being forced to participate in the “health care” system and purchasing insurance (which I haven’t in many years). We are with you here Dr. Jeff!